ramblings on PHP, SQL, the web, politics, ultimate frisbee and what else is on in my life
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Re: Let's think PDO!

I'm hoping for PDO-Mysqlnd. I use PDO for most of my projects (at least the ones where I have sway on framework, etc.)

Re: Let's think PDO!

Lukas, I very much agree that PDO needs to be the way forward. However, I am not sure what someone like me is able to do to help that.

To define "someone like me...": I am the database maintainer for the Drupal project. Drupal 7 includes a new database layer that was gutted and rewritten from the ground up on PDO. The base part of the system is largely routing logic for connection handling, plus various extensions via subclasses for result sets, better transaction handling, etc. Then on top of that we also have a series of lightweight but robust query builders that mimic SQL a fair bit rather than trying to be a full ORM. Right now in this system we have support the "big three" open source databases: MySQL, PostgreSQL, and SQLite.

So any improvement in PDO will come back to help Drupal in time. That's no question. Here's the catch: I haven't touched C code in years and do not have the resources to get versed in PDO's code base, and neither do the vast majority of Drupal developers. The best we've been able to do is report one or two bugs, and every time Microsoft says "will you please support MS SQL in Drupal" replying with "write a PDO driver that works and the rest is easy, ball's in your court, kthxbye". :-) (So far they've still not listened to us.)

So given that, what would be of use? I figure you've probably got plenty of feature requests clogging the bug tracker, and from the sound of it plenty of bugs already reported. C-skilled labor, we don't really have to offer. What would be of value here?

Re: Let's think PDO!

I think that people seem to be missing something here ... and 'support for the big three' is then MAIN one. I HAVE tried to use pdo_firebird, but it simply fails to handle situations where TEXT fields are provided as text BLOB's in a Firebird (Interbase, Oracle) conversion. I've had to pull PDO back out of one project and restore ADOdb simply to maintain compatibility with the databases that WERE available before PDO was used. Drupal needs some major work to add other databases as do MANY projects.
If we are looking SIMPLY at data abstraction, then PDO does not work ... but we DO need to also handle all of the other areas that are now growing driver specific patches in the code.

Re: Let's think PDO!

@Larry: One if the ways you can help is with letting us know about the pain points you saw. Lack of an SQL Server PDO driver is one and I keep pestering Microsoft about that. Pierre is at least on board already to help fix bugs etc. Also you guys can help with writing tests and documentation.

@Lester: Please, can you tone down the drama. Don't you see that we are currently trying to address any deficiencies in PDO? We are not "missing" the fact that PDO has room for improvement.

Re: Let's think PDO!

@Lukas: How would you want those pain points reported? Toss them into the bug tracker? Long email to internals? Long email to the PDO list?

Re: Let's think PDO!

@Larry: Just put them on the brainstorming page in the wiki: http://wiki.php.net/internals/pdo/brainstorming

If you do not have an account submit a request and let me know so that I can upgrade your karma.

Re: Let's think PDO!

PDO is really where the community wants to be. <

How is this known?

To discover what PDO is ... or is targeted to be, I looked at PHP.net ... http://us2.php.net/manual/en/intro.pdo.php
... expecting a succinct statement of objectives and PDO definition, reflecting consolidated current opinion(s).

I expected that debate about what PDO was (or should be) would be reflected in such a location.

How can people build to a non-existent recipe?

When Alice (in Wonderland), confronting the cat in the tree at the fork in the road, asked: "Which road should I take?" The cat asked, "Where are you going?" Alice replied, "I don't know where I'm going". So, the cat said, "Then, it doesn't matter which road you choose!"

I would think that PDO developers can not expect to reach a goal which hasn't been agreed upon and clearly and succinctly stated ... somewhere.

Re: Let's think PDO!

Right, which is why I asked for people to join the discussion on the list to start brainstorming about where we want PDO to go and what we want it to be. From these discussions we have already begun to notice that there are some conflicting ideas of what the scope of PDO should be for example. However only if we talk about it will be find out those differences and only this way can we look if we can reconcile these differences so that the community can in fact show vendors where we want to be.

Re: Let's think PDO!

Here is an ORM that works with Firebird
https://www.kellermansoftware.com/p-47-net-data-access-layer.aspx

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